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Talk:Pune roads
At a meeting conducted by Loksatta at Aurora Towers on 27.8.08, the Commissioner asked me to be present. I am glad I went, since it provided some insights into this issue. This is the gist of the discussion MC = Commissioner, LS = Loksatta Mandals essentially made the point that due to crowds the mandaps have to be very sturdy and that none of the solutions presented by the PMC were adequate. Hence digging of roads was unavoidable. They want it so that PMC should collect money from them and repair the damage later. Some were willing to take responsibility of repairing the damage, claimed that they had already done this in previous years and that again PMC should tell them best way to fill holes. Additionally they said that with these “holeless” designs the PMC would be fully responsible if there was an accident. MC made it clear that digging of roads was not acceptable and that no matter if it is filled later, the road surface integrity is compromised. He further stated that given the current state of the PMC machinery it was not possible to take on the additional load created by the mandals. He reminded the Mandals that they had been informed very early this time and that hence no excuse was acceptable. Mayor wanted to seek some compromise. She split the problem into two. The mandap and the poles that are now erected for advertisements. She felt that even if the Corporation turned a blind eye to the first, the latter needed discussion. Mandals claimed that due to drop in vargani collection and rising costs, advertisements were crucial to their survival. Also that crowds require even these poles to be very secure, hence digging roads was necessary. Mayor agreed that advertisements were needed and reiterated that she was not against them. But she asked that they reduce the number of poles used and use the non-paved part of the road and avoid destruction to the footpaths. She also pointed out that not all Mandals face such crowds and that the numerous Mandals all over the city are doing the same and should be avoided. MC was however not happy with this and made it clear that very soon no roads would have unpaved portions and that Mandals have also been destroying the concrete gutters. Mandals also issued velied threats throughout the discussion essentially saying that during the Ganpati season karyakarta emotions were high and that high handed and arrogant behavior by the administration could lead to “tension”. This was then followed by the submission by Mandals that they have already dug 80% of the holes and that this time the administration should let this pass. LS said they have been hearing this for too many years and that this year at least a 100 Mandals should show the way by minimizing road digging and finding innovative designs that would not require roads to be dug every year. MC pointed out that noise law is being complied with by Mandals (more or less). He wondered if only court orders would help curb this problem. Mayor also wanted to discriminate between registered Mandals that have taken all the requisite permissions vs. the unregistered ones. Some Mandals agreed, some said that this was not a big issue since getting permissions was quite easy in any case. Mandals also pointed out that many of the advertisement poles were being erected by purely advertiseing companies who were not even a part of any Mandal. The meeting ended with a summary of the discussion and again the velied threat by the Mandals about consequences of strict action. Ranjit.gadgil 13:36, 1 September 2008 (UTC) Social Boycott and Alternatives #People's representatives i.e. the Corporators - whether majority of them support the mandals. Have the major parties taken a public stand either way ? Can the General Body pass a Resolution in support of PMC ? #Why should we depend solely on PMC or the law ? Is Civil Boycott of transgressing Mandals possible ? Can Lok Satta and Sakaal lead a Civil Boycott movement ? In other words instead of only publishing photos of pandals which have dug holes, can they, alongwith non-political public figures as well as Pundits of major Ganpati mandirs, urge Punekars not to visit these pandals ? #In terms of law and order, terrorist attacks, access to emergency services, should roads at all be partially blocked by pandals ? Instead, since Ganpati celebrations are and should remain an integral part of every Punekar's social /religious life, can Municipal school grounds and public gardens be opened freely to pandals Buddha id 11:19, 3 September 2008 (UTC) Non-cooperation is the way forward Its about time that masses stop cooperating with these Mandals. Advertisers too should be named and shamed for sponsoring any Mandal that breaches the law. I wonder what this 'holeless' design is, but when you look at how deep they dig, one can see that the poles are hardly supported by anything (so much for safety). In the past, I have suggested that barrels are used to support bamboo pole's. One can either fill the barrels with sand and rubble to support the pole or even produce pre-fabricated barrels filled with concrete with a central gap to secure the pole. I have seen such pre-fabricated barrels in use in UK where they are used to erect temporary traffic lights during road works. see - *http://www.flickr.com/photos/martin_addison/2734977200/ *http://www.flickr.com/photos/harryhalibut/2205952922/ *http://www.flickr.com/photos/bigsky/373438856/ (closer look shows prefabricated cement within which the pole is secured). ASJ 18:21, 1 September 2008 (UTC) Some additional suggestions We need stake holders (public) to put forth a plan to PMC, political parties and Mandals (organisations that erect pandals for other religious celebrations as well). A few pointers regarding what should be communicated are detailed below - #The barrels idea needs to be put forth to PMC. #They should with our help reach out to political parties / corporators / Mandals (and our Navratri etc related organisations). #PMC should after a phase of 2 month conslutation finalise a plan - #All licenced Mandlas to sign up to no road and pavement digging policy #PMC to operate Zero tolerance (non-compliance = cancellation of licence with no renewal for 2 years). # Mandals should use Ganesh Idols made from eco-friendly material only (including colourings). # Mandals should show transperency and accountability for the use of electricity and pay their bills and not steal electricity. #Mandlas should be erected in public community spaces - school grounds, inside residential societies, parks and not roads and lanes #Zero tolerance on noise levels as well as times (non-compliance = cancellation of licence with no renewal for 2 years). #Type of music - let each Mandal submit the albums and numbers they will play to each mohalla committee for approval. #Mandals registered with PMC / Charity Commissioner should be listed in news papers. People should be advised to give donations only to the Organisations listed. Right to refuse should remain and be respected by Mandals. Mandals found guility should lose their license for minimum 2 years. #Intoxication - Police should carry out random checks - breathlyse and urine dip stick checks if need be. #Zero tolerance on violence (non-compliance = cancellation of licence with no renewal for 2 years). #Accountability - Can there be a way in which money collected is not wasted / misused? Can we expect that in keeping with the true spirit of Lokmanya's idea, each Mandal should publish (and possibly again get approval from Mohalla committee) a theme or programme which helps the community in some way - awareness regarding - RTI / driver education / climate change / etc. #PMC should appoint a company to provide these pre-fabricated barrels (or alternatively produce themselves) which should be leased out for the 10 days. Mechanisms should be in place for the given company to remove the barrels in 48 hours after close of the given celebration. PMC should regulate costs to keep it within reach / alternatively sponsors may be roped in to provide these for free. #If advertisers and sponsorship is in use - this should be regulated as well. Festivals are for families, kids - adverts of tabacco, spirits, etc should not be allowed. #Some if not all should apply to political parties who keep erecting props of their leaders - in fact PMC should have designated notice borads where A4 size posters should be allowed. #No Party poster, hoardings should obstruct signage, traffic lights, street lights or damage public property including trees. Adhiraj Joglekar ASJ 09:02, 3 September 2008 (UTC)